36Watt Vs 18Watt

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Thu 02/25/10 9:05 am

To those who have played on both...Does the 36Watt amp have the same flavor / sound as the 18Watt only louder? Thanks

Post by **zaphod_phil** » Thu 02/25/10 10:32 am

I've actually not played both kinds, but the consensus is that the 36W is only slightly louder (3dB), but has a good bit more clean headroom. You get the same kind of relationship between 50w and 100W Marshalls. So if you need to play clean tones at higher volume levels, then a 36W is what you want. I'm more into the distortion side of things, which is why I stick to regular 18Ws.

A couple of YouTube clips demonstrating the 36W tone:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvcDYBOAC2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KiuY8FREWDE

mcrracer · Post by **mcrracer** » Thu 02/25/10 2:09 pm

Thanks

FireLewis · Post by **FireLewis** » Fri 04/09/10 3:53 pm

Ive finished convert my 18 watt to 36 watt and I must said it really kick ass. I was happy with my 18watt, but the things that bugged me are away with the 36. Now I feel like playing in the best amp I ever owned. I've used GDS trannys and wow there are very great, tight sound, everything is there, well balanced. Very easy to convert. I know it all depend on taste, an yes there is no big volume (DB) differences between 18 and 36 but the sound is different. I found in band situation, the sound is less muddy and less lost in the mix, more tight and more headroom (as expected).
thanks to everyone here, 18 watt.com rules!!!

TWANG · Post by **TWANG** » Fri 02/18/11 4:12 pm

Where should I start reading for a 36W?

Is this just changing the power tubes and using the 18W otherwise?

point me!

Post by **rock_mumbles** » Fri 02/18/11 5:39 pm

TWANG
Where should I start reading for a 36W?

Is this just changing the power tubes and using the 18W otherwise?

point me!

You're in the right place -- the 36 watt room
It needs a bigger PT and OT, a few circuit changes and two more EL84's

TWANG · Post by **TWANG** » Fri 02/18/11 7:18 pm

I'd feel better if I had the superlite working.
but when does stupidity ever stop me?

Would you suggest I build a PTP 18 watt first.. ?

Seems to me I may as well just dive in..
choose a schematic.. list parts.. look at some layouts others have used..
buy a chassis and go forth.

phsyconoodler · Post by **phsyconoodler** » Wed 03/16/11 2:41 pm

Quote:"I've actually not played both kinds, but the consensus is that the 36W is only slightly louder (3dB)"

Maybe that is so,but it sure sounds a LOT louder to my ears.My 36 watt lite has near the same volume level as a 50 watt plexi and it's too loud to play flat out at any gig.Not so with my 18 watt lite.
So 3DB is PLENTY loud.And yes,it does have much more clean headroom which makes it really nice for versatility.I always use a master volume on my amps so I can get that 18 watt grind without getting told to turn down all the time and still having enough clean headroom for country and ballads and such things.
That being said,my 18 watt is what I play the most.Plug and play.
I use my guitar's volume a lot.

Post by **zaphod_phil** » Wed 03/16/11 3:02 pm

...,but it sure sounds a LOT louder to my ears.My 36 watt lite has near the same volume level as a 50 watt plexi and it's too loud to play flat out at any gig.Not so with my 18 watt lite.

Perhaps it does, but 3dB is the minimum difference in volume level the ear can hear. So there's something else going on. Like perhaps you're playing mainly in each amp's clean range. That's where the difference in wattage really counts.

You need to increase power by a factor of 10 to get double the volume level (assuming the same speakers). So an 18W is around half as loud as a 180W.

phsyconoodler · Post by **phsyconoodler** » Wed 03/16/11 3:45 pm

A 3DB increase is sometimes enough to hurt your ears.
And the added 'girth' of the tone is quite a bit.
It is very noticeable no matter what the numbers say.
There is no comparison between an 18 watt dimed and a 36 watt dimed into the same speaker cab.
It's not 'just a little louder' .It's a HUGE difference. I could care less about the 3db. I get more of everything from a 36 watter. LOTS more.
It's simply not an insignificant difference.

Post by **zaphod_phil** » Wed 03/16/11 4:37 pm

18W can be enough to hurt your ears too, as many have testified. And simply changing loudspeakers can give you a 3dB volume boost. I'm with you on the added girth. A 36W is a wonderful amp, whichever way you look at it.

katopan · Post by **katopan** » Wed 03/16/11 4:45 pm

Minimum difference the human ear can hear is generally accepted as 1dB.

Post by **zaphod_phil** » Wed 03/16/11 5:09 pm

Then I stand corrected....

mark0614 · Post by **mark0614** » Mon 07/04/11 4:15 am

I love my 18 watter, but it sounds like I would have liked the 36 watt amp more.

I'm using Mercury iron which is good, they make quite a few variations on the stock iron. Including increased B+.

I suppose the next question is who makes good iron for these amps and what size are they?

TWANG · Post by **TWANG** » Mon 07/04/11 4:53 pm

I took my baby will into GC
to 'try out a speaker cabinet'..heh heh.

everybody in there came over to look at it... the cosmetic difference accounted for part of that.
but some came over just after hearing it.
clean.. with a tele and a strat..

employees were complimentary, but corporate loyalty seemed to
attentuate.

I know darn well that the orange tiny terror wouldn't compare to it for tone or volume, as I've played that before in there.

I'm shutting down my business. which was supposed to be a hobby in the first place, because I am sick of rebuilding valve juniors.
I've done 6V6 EL84 5E3 and superlite IIB v7
as well as a bunch of other brands.
Now I'm going to build things I want to build.
and a 36 watt is very high on my right after I finish what I have list.

I had a pv delta blues here, 30W 2X10 and I was not freaked out by a volume difference but boy was that thing fat.
So I think four el84 will be the one I go for.

I'm also finally cleaning up my notes.. and arranging them so I can
do what I know and not have to keep freakng out over stupid details.
The shop part of my life was really interfering with logical linear learning.
Now I will have time to read my Merllin, for instance.

I'm hoping for a small singularity...

Cathode_Ray · Post by **Cathode_Ray** » Mon 07/11/11 7:36 am

I have played (and own both). 18watt rarely leaves studio - 36watt gets played out a lot. They do sound very similar. There are multiple issues here though.
Perception: Part of the issue with percieved volume has to do with the ear. It's not "linear" - I frequently record a loud amp only to find it sounds VERY different when listening to playback. Large and small rooms also effect perception.
db: Is a logarithmic value - 1 db(smallest audiable change) at converstional levels is not the same as one at loud guitar levels. A 3db change(power factor of 10) at livingroom levels is nothing like a 3db change at Marshall 100 levels... The ear just doesn't work the same at loud levels as it does at low levels...
What, what, speak up please...

guitarmike2107 · Post by **guitarmike2107** » Tue 07/12/11 3:37 am

Perception: Part of the issue with percieved volume has to do with the ear. It's not "linear" - I frequently record a loud amp only to find it sounds VERY different when listening to playback. Large and small rooms also effect perception.

I have the same problem all the time, I guess this is one reason to have isolation booths

zach5150 · Post by **zach5150** » Sun 07/17/11 11:13 am

So, what about a 1/2 power switch? Does that do a good job of providing the flexibility of having both amps?

149 · Post by **149** » Wed 08/10/11 10:38 am

Just out of interest, why do so many amp designs in the 30 watt range use the 4x el84 PP configuration. Wouldn't it be simpler (and cheaper) to go with a cathode biased 2x el34 PP output?

Greg

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