Best New EL84

[musicamex]

You know, I'm a tube snob seeking out old tubes (although I'm just as happy with used pulls as NOS). I keep the better of the new tube types around, and use them with results that are acceptable to me.

For example, I run a pair of RCA power tubes in my Lite IIb. Sounds great. The JJ's sound 85% as good. When I'm playing only by myself, I can readily notice that little something extra (goes to 11 maybe? ). With a bass and a drummer thrown in there, I'd likely never be able to tell or feel the difference between those RCA's and the JJ's. I've found this to be consistant with the 6V6's and 12AX7's too. Get the best of breed new production, and when being played live you'll never miss that last little something extra.

If you record a lot or play only by yourself, the NOS are worth seeking out. If you play out a lot, with loud drummers, the new productions are just fine. Save the NOS stuff for the guys that are recording.

i agree. my cache of old 6l6, 6v6 and el84 tubes are what i use for ME and when i want that extra sparkle. they don't leave my place for a gig. an old rca or sylvania or especially the grey plate coke bottle 6l6 tubes give my low watt single ended 5E3 style amps something extra. no doubt. but i wouldn't waste it on a margarita soaked crowd who couldn't even tell if it was a tube amp in the first place.

some really amazing odd ball tubes out there, like some japanese EL84's that came out of old movie projectors i found are really killer too. it all comes down to "tasting" them and learning. kind of like good fresh salsa. if you know what it tastes like with cilantro you can appreciate the difference. if not a bottle of old el paso will do.

lots of the old stock i have are pulls and they test better than new tubes in more than half of what i find. pulls can be a great source of bargains and turn up in the oddest places. don't forget the other parts associated with old amps. some are packing some amazing iron.

[ny_racer_xxx]

Mex, I have inlaws in South America, do you think there's any stash of NOS tubes there?

CR

[musicamex]

Mex, I have inlaws in South America, do you think there's any stash of NOS tubes there?

CR

if they are in a big city i have no doubt there are tubes and amps to be found, though latin american countries tend to scrap out anything of value ie transfromers for copper. however if something has potential value it might stay on a store shelf for decades. i'd have them check out old timers with tv/ radio repair shops. i have found caches of old pulls (most of which aren't of direct use for us axe amp guys) and cot mostly el84 and 6v6 tubes which were common in old hi fi gear. also 6l6 and some KILLER old coke bottle tubes.

i found an old bell pa amp that had jan (joint army navy) mil spec tubes in it. they can be the best longest lasting tubes and are built for war, military or rock and roll. i made the best harp amp ever out of that little gem. real point to point wiring, not tag board or eylet card wiring. the old point to point are great platforms for learning as you see exactly where and what is in the signal path.

[ny_racer_xxx]

Thanks for the heads up.... I was thinking that technology trickles a little slower to some of the 3rd world countries, maybe some of the spares were still being stocked for repairs....


CR

[bluesmagoo69]

Just a quick blurp about the Mullard re-issue I just tried a pair in my
18 watt and was very disappointed with the tone.

[ny_racer_xxx]

That's what I heard....

CR

[drake]

I believe most of the TAD tubes are well tested and selected Chinese and seem to be of very good quality.

Chinese, they are, good quality, they are not, never will be.

TAD (tube amp doctor), is a company here in Germany, run by Stefan Meyer & his conglomorates. They used to be largely supported by Ruby Tubes/Magic Parts; and used their buying power for some time, until they decided to drop Ruby Tubes like a stone, and go it their own way; sort of like the "we don´t need you anymore" attitude. They are the sort of company that sell 89 cent chinese ceramic tube sockets for $5 bucks a piece! Or orange drops for $4 bucks each!

They are the biggest "vintage amp parts" rip-off company here in Germany, and only exist through the stupidity and non-knowledgement of musicians and amp enthusiasts.
They invested a lot of money in one of China´s tube makers, so they hype their tubes no end, to sell them.

I´ve used them many times before, with mostly negative results; I´m wiser now.

I recommend avoiding them; go with what you know.

drake

[malt]

I recommend avoiding them; go with what you know.

drake

+1

[mrfoo]

I recommend avoiding them; go with what you know.

drake

+1

+1

[MadDitch]

Any one try these yet? Reissue Genalex Gold Lion

http://www.hotroxuk.com/genalex-gold-li ... 733-0.html

[sandmannn69]

Just got a matched pair of JJ/Tesla EL84s this afternoon from TubeDepot for the Baby Will. After a 15 min. warmup, cranked it up and Holy S---!, the creamy, crunchy blues were oozing out of that V30. Wow, I thought it sounded good with the old pair I initially put in it. Now I see why Marshall can get $2000+ for this amp. I was running it thru a mini-mass attenuator, too, which does suck tone a bit. I used a JJ/Tesla in my SE Valve Junior, too, huge improvement over stock Sovtek (of course). JJ/Tesla EL84s seem to be the best for decent gain and low noise.

[drake]

JJ/Tesla EL84s seem to be the best for decent gain and low noise.

Yes, they came stock in my 1974X too, and I like them.
However I do urge you to try a pair of the new EH EL84´s; they´re different to the normal Sovteks, and sound even better than old Tesla roundplate/hexplates that I´ve had in the past, and last much longer; get a hot set and you may be in for a surprise; more bass and more crunchy mids, and the highs aren´t so "bitey" anymore and the sustain......

Take Care
drake[/i]

[kleuck]

[grndluxe]

i'm a little late on this topic, but just to add my 2 cents about EL84s.
i had a pair of JJs in a dockery TMB and thought they were a bit harsh at the time. i sold them on ebay and bought a pair of NOS General Rohrens. the JJs were much better. the Generals were very STERILE. no 'personality' at all.

[supah]

i had a pair of JJs in a dockery TMB and thought they were a bit harsh at the time.

I have the exact same amp + same tubes (JJ EL84s) and had the exact same experience. I don't know if they were too gainy or what, but the sound when the amp was cranked was much too grainy and brittle for my liking. Put the 6v6s in and it was much better.

However, I thought that this could also have been contributed to the way the amp is set up... if you solder in the proper resistor for the EL84s, you can't just swap them out for 6v6s, but if you use the proper resistor for the 6v6s, you CAN swap them out for EL84s... but if you do the EL84s will be biased cold I THINK.

grndluxe - when you used the JJ EL's did you use the right resistor and still come to the same solution?

[zaphod_phil]

I have the exact same amp + same tubes (JJ EL84s) and had the exact same experience. I don't know if they were too gainy or what, but the sound when the amp was cranked was much too grainy and brittle for my liking. Put the 6v6s in and it was much better.

I do urge you to try a pair of the new EH EL84´s; they´re different to the normal Sovteks, and sound even better than old Tesla roundplate/hexplates that I´ve had in the past, and last much longer; get a hot set and you may be in for a surprise; more bass and more crunchy mids, and the highs aren´t so "bitey" anymore and the sustain......

So Pato, maybe you need to try the EH EL84s to get the kind of tone you like from EL84s.

However, I thought that this could also have been contributed to the way the amp is set up... if you solder in the proper resistor for the EL84s, you can't just swap them out for 6v6s, but if you use the proper resistor for the 6v6s, you CAN swap them out for EL84s... but if you do the EL84s will be biased cold I THINK.

Yes, that's right, and it probably won't sound too good. So if you have two sets of power tube sockets, you need to put a different cathode resistor and cap on each. But you really also need a different resistor in the phase invertor for each type of tube - ie 22k or 47k.

[leslie]

i'm a little late on this topic, but just to add my 2 cents about EL84s.
i had a pair of JJs in a dockery TMB and thought they were a bit harsh at the time. i sold them on ebay and bought a pair of NOS General Rohrens. the JJs were much better. the Generals were very STERILE. no 'personality' at all.

general rohre are actually russian tubes which have nothing in common with german tubes of yesteryear( rohre = tube).
Simillar story with Zaerix tubes on ebay.
If you need good comparison with JJ try Tungsram or GE (you can still get them at good price NOS)

Not connected but general:
Also please notice that military tubes sometimes can sound sterile but have prolonged lifetime and whitstand higher plates voltages.

Regards

[supah]

drake/phil -

by EH do you mean Electro-Harmonix?

phil -

so before start playing with ELs I should definitely put together an amp specifically for them... biased correctly and whatnot.

[drake]

drake/phil -

by EH do you mean Electro-Harmonix?

Yes, Electro Harmonix.

Got some old Russian 6P14P´s from the late 70´s recently; they seem very robust, you can rap yer knuckles on the glass, and nothing rattles!

Not sure how they´ll sound, I´ve read elsewhere that they take time to burn in... I´ll try ´em next tube-change.

The EL84EH´s do last a long time though, and sound GREAT!

Happy New Year
drake

[rjgtr]

phil -

so before start playing with ELs I should definitely put together an amp specifically for them... biased correctly and whatnot.

You can make a new amp (an 18watt Lite IIb is a perfect start) or as phil says modify your existing amp to switch between the two types of tubes.

If the amp has both 8 and 9 pin sockets installed for the power tubes, you can share everything except for the cathode resistor/cap. You would have a different value for each type. Then you should also switch between a 47k and 22k on the PI. You can do this by having the 47k as your soldered in value and then paralleling in another 47k with a swtich (two 47k in parallel equals 23.5k - close enough).